The "Yoda" of PT - Using Technology to Give Runners a Competitive Blueprint with Kevin Vandi

The "Yoda" of PT - Using Technology to Give Runners a Competitive Blueprint with Kevin Vandi


Ok - we have a really fun episode for you today! Kevin Vandi is often called the “yoda” of physical therapy - maybe it’s because of his deep knowledge of the human body, or maybe it’s his ability to breakdown complex biomechanical problems into a lamens terms.

Whatever it is - Kevin has some Star Wars like technology at his practice Competitive Edge in San Jose. In this episode you’ll learn how Kevin’s motion capture tech, pressure sensing treadmill, and high speed cameras have helped countless athletes detect and correct running inefficiencies - including our very own coach.

You’ll learn about common problems he sees from his athletes, common injuries, and his systematic approach on solving them. You’re going to learn so much, and especially If you’re a geek like me - you’re really going to love this conversation!

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Shoulder EMG

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Podcast Transcription

The following transcript is provided for your convenience. It was created through a program, and may not be entirely accurate to our conversation.
Kevin Vandi: [00:00:00]

we believer running is a skill. Like you learn how to play the guitar, where you learn how to shoot a free throw running can be learned as well at any age for anybody, no matter the injury, you can learn to be a better runner.
There's no such thing as you can't teach an old dog new tricks. We've been runners all the way up in their eighties. And we've seen runners all the way down in the teenage years to be able to improve their form. Hell it takes it deliberate practice and the right system,

Kevin Chang: [00:00:29]

Welcome to the race mob podcast this is episode number 26. I'm Kevin entrepreneur technology and fitness nerd, and the founder of race mob. I'm joined by master motivator, founder of two legit fitness co-chair of the Taji 100 R RC, a certified coach USA track and field certified official the incomparable Bertrand Newson.
Okay. We have a really fun episode for you today. Kevin Vandi is oftentimes called the Yoda of physical therapy. Maybe it's because of his deep knowledge of the human body, or maybe it's his ability to break down complex biomechanical problems into layman's terms. Whatever it is. Kevin has some star Wars like technology at his practice, competitive edge in San Jose.
In this episode, you'll learn how Kevin's motion capture tech. Pressure sensing treadmill and high-speed cameras have helped countless athletes detect and correct their running inefficiencies, including our very own coach.
You'll learn about common problems. He sees with beginning runners, common injuries. He sees come into his practice and his systematic approach to solving these problems. You're going to learn so much. And especially if you're a geek like me, you're going to really, really love and enjoy this conversation.

This episode is brought to you by erase mob and inclusive community for endurance athletes. If you like our podcast, you'll love our YouTube channel, where we keep you up to date with news for the running world and give you tips that will help you improve door running.
Check us out by searching race mob on YouTube and subscribe today.
All right. We are so excited to welcome Kevin Vandy to the race mob podcast.
Welcome to the show, Kevin, happy to have you here.

Kevin Vandi: [00:02:12]

Thanks for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Kevin Chang: [00:02:13]

Awesome. So Kevin, as I understand it, you're founder of competitive edge. Tell us a little bit about the company, how you got into the whole business and how you got started.

Kevin Vandi: [00:02:24]

Sure. Yeah, so I started competitive edge in 2015.
I had been a physical therapist here in the Bay area since 2008 and primarily specialized in sports orthopedics. But I had a situation where Chris powers, who is a awesome PT in our field, down at USC, he came up and presented on his gait lab, which he had down in Los Angeles. And for me, that kind of blew my mind.
It was the aha moment of my career, where I was like that, that sounds amazing. Like, what is that? Like? What's a gait lab. What do you do with that sort of practice? And so I went down and study with him for six months and, you know, learn that you can take data and technology and you can apply it to the field of physical therapy in particular to runners.
And that was the big thing I wanted to do in the Bay area. Being a tech hub, I wanted to bring data and technology to not only physical therapy, but more specifically to runners. When I was young, I tore my ACL playing football and I couldn't play. Contact sports after that. And so I get into running and admittedly, my first run was supposed to be 1.2 miles and I made it about halfway
through a running career, but you know, really that sparked my interest for whatever reason that I don't know if you call it failure or. Initial moment. I was like, well, I didn't do that, but I really liked the process. You know, I just started picking up running late high school and into college. And since then, like running has like been my passion.
It's been that little itch. I can't scratch enough. And so I've read and gone, traveled around the country, working with experts. And so after seeing Chris powers and Haftar having that edge and having that passion, I decided to go full bore and buy all the equipment and open up competitive edge of physical therapy in San Jose.
So it was a lot of talks with my wife and wondering whether I should give her a job and fledgling into a full business. We were having a kid at the moment. It was going to be our fourth. And so it was like, you know, it was one of those moments. I was like, we're just going to take the, take the run and go.
And since we've been very blessed, we've met some wonderful people in triathlon clubs and running clubs, and we've just had a blast ending injury, helping people improve performance and really getting the most possible benefit out of a physical therapy experience. That's incredible.

Kevin Chang: [00:04:36]

What made you want to go into physical therapy?

Kevin Vandi: [00:04:38]

Yeah, in high school, I was always kind of into fitness and biology. I was always a science nerd and, I was running back in high school. It doesn't mean a lot. I was at a small high school, but I ended up getting hit, tore my ACL and meniscus had physical therapy for a year. Completely rehab. Ready to go.
Got hit again, retort my ACL and meniscus. So I had two major surgeries. But since then, I had an awesome time with my PT talking sports, shooting the breeze. He just seemed like he had like the best job in the world. And so, you know, at that point I was like, yeah, this is definitely what I want to do with my career.
I'm I'm not as like particular to be a surgeon. And you know, medicine was like, yeah, medical school sounds cool, but really I want to work with people. I want to be on my feet. I want to be active. And I had seen the benefit of using movement as medicine in my life, going from a place where I couldn't walk.
It was on crutches. In pain depressed that I couldn't couldn't play sports anymore. And then having someone lift me up, being encourager, push me to exceed at my, you know, at maximum capacity, that's a hundred percent what I wanted to do for other people. And that started my physical therapy career.

Kevin Chang: [00:05:41]

So I mean, two ACL surgeries in high school.
That is crazy. I mean, you touched a little bit about Chris powers and so what about his school of teaching made? You want to learn more?

Kevin Vandi: [00:05:53]

What was different about it? So physical therapy, if you know, listeners or you guys have never been physical therapy is, , for the most part place where you go, you have an evaluation that may be, you know, watch you walk up and down the hall.
They maybe do some strength tests. They do some massage, they put on some ice and STEM and that's kind of, kind of the experience I had gone to school and I got my doctorate and I was. Already practicing in a sports orthopedic center. But, you know, I knew with, with professional sports teams and even people that's like your weekend warrior, they just wanted more out of their experience.
So Chris powers basically took what a gait lab does, which is like a research oriented physical therapy center, where they put on specialized, 3d sensors. And have you walk on pressure plates and they use high speed cameras. He took that research model and he brought it to outpatient physical therapy.
And for me, I just thought that was the coolest thing in the world, because, you know, no matter whether you walk and only walk a mile or you run ultra marathons, you just feel like a baller when you got the sensor strapped up and you're doing your thing and you've got these cameras on you, you just feel like it's.
Like rush thing. And you're like, I'm in like the best position possible to figure out my problem to improve my performance. and being, I liked science. I like technology. I like people is like, this seems like the fit for me. And as my wife will tell you, I came home from his presentation and she was just like, yeah, I knew we were done at that point.
I knew you had books and articles and you were calling people and like, you didn't sleep for a week. Like you, you had like your thing that you were going to do.

Bertrand Newson: [00:07:22]

And Kevin, have you seen technology change in the PT field over the last, you know, half decade, decade or so?

Kevin Vandi: [00:07:29]

Yeah, sure. You know, with the, with Garmin watches and Apple watches and this whole kind of health data push, you're seeing more and more, people want like concrete numbers about their health.
you know, they know their heart rates and cadence and, you know, they know their landing force is how many miles they run, but the problem is you come into physical therapy and they take out like a plastic goniometer and they're like, well, let's take a look at this. And there's a lot of human error. So yeah, you're seeing a lot more therapists adopt a kind of data oriented approach, but it's maybe a, a one-off device or like a piece of data or like one part of it.
Whereas what we wanted to do is basically kind of the soup to nuts. Like every possible piece of data you can get about your running form or about movement in general, we wanted to make it. So there was no stone left unturned and people felt like they knew their problem pinpointed early. So then you can create a plan going forward.
But yeah, for sure, our data is going to be a part of physical therapy. They now like the app, Bertrand that you've been using with, for your exercises now tracks your pain. How many days you did it, you know, what's your. Sleep is like, everything's going to be tracked in the new age of medicine. And it's about coordinating the whole piece together.
Like you're treating a human, you're not treating a knee or shoulder or a plantar fasciitis. You know, you're, you're treating a person who loves to run or a person who loves to dance and my job in any PT shop or. Anybody in the health field is to allow you to perform at your best with the littlest amount of, implications elsewhere.
Walk us through

Kevin Chang: [00:08:59]

if a runner comes in and you know, what does that analysis look like? What are the things, what are the machines that you're putting them on? I know Berkshire and you got to get, get this done firsthand on Thursday so we can get both. Yeah, we can get the patient perspective. We can get the physical therapist perspective of it.
What's going on. What's happening is as somebody walks in.

Kevin Vandi: [00:09:22]

Yeah. So, you know, runners usually find us online or because they have a problem or an injury and they always talk to our front desk. Staff beforehand letting us know what their goals are, what they're hoping to get out of it. So they come in prepared like, Hey, this is what I want to achieve in the session, which is a really key piece.
We want to make sure we understand the runner. Some people they're first time runners. Some people are like, Hey, I only get painted mile 17. We want to tailor that exam to you. So from the first time you call us, we're going to make sure we understand your goals. So when you come in and you're going to meet one-on-one with one of our doctors of physical therapy, they all have backgrounds in biomechanics and sports conditioning, but we're going to sit down and have a 15, 20 minute conversation.
Get a good medical history, running history. Talk about what shoes you wear, your running data. What's your longterm and short-term goals are for running injury history. Make sure we know, okay. Out of this exam, we want to figure out a, B and C. Once we have that figured out, then we get our, our called our inertial measurement unit sensors, or I am use.
And if you think the easiest way to describe it, if you've ever seen like a Madden video game and they got all those balls on their body and they got the cool suit and they're making their like, like video game avatar, it's kind of like that type of technology. So we put sensors on your feet, shins, thighs, pelvis, and torso.
And what those do they give you a 3d skeletal avatar of your movement? So you could dance, you could run, you can walk it does it lift, it doesn't matter. We can record any emotion, but for runners in particular, it's going to show detailed to the degree angle of your range of motion when you run. So it's extremely accurate technology.
And when you have things like for instance, knee pain, you know, you really have like a five degree window. If that knee moves five degrees, one way or the other that's enough to trigger a problem. And it's so small that you can't pick it up with the human eye. So that's where that type of technology comes in.
We also use an instrumented treadmill. So it's not just any treadmill. The Trimble's got a 5,000 pressure sensors in the belt. So what it does is, you know, typically you might go to a shoe store and you stand in a foot analyzer, which is awesome. And it's a good initial point. Cause it's going to tell you what type of foot arch you have.
And what shoes you need. Well, we take that a step further and on our treadmill, you get it in real time. So as you're running, it's going to record and store the hotspots in your running form. Where are you putting the most amount of pressure? How does your body mass move through your foot? What's your step with your cadence, your stride length, how long you're in the air, how long you're on the ground, literally any metric you want that treadmill can spit out about your, about your running efficiency.
And then finally we have two high speed cameras. that recorded 300 frames per second. So there's nothing missed from a visual perspective. And then we basically record usually a long, slow pace, race, pace record. And then like we did with Bertrand, we sit down and we take 15 minutes or so, and we walk you through, step-by-step what we're seeing.
And we can make that process as nerdy or as can you, do you want to the runner? But our job is to find what we call, like the thing, the thing that's causing the problem. We always say, you know, every runner can work on something. it's a good thing that we find problems. A lot of runners might get nervous.
Like, Oh, you're going to find problems. I'm going to, I don't want to be in front of the camera. I don't know. We tell them no, it's awesome. If we find things, because then we can create a plan and we create a process. Sorry, can we take them through that presentation? We find the thing. Then we take them through a full PT exam.
So strength range of motion, nerve testing, squatting, CAF, testing, strength, tests, everything get hard numbers there. And then we finally lay out the plan of based on what you have and based on what we see in the data, this is how long it's going to take you to reach your goals. Here's the plan to get there.
Here's how many sessions it's going to take. So a runner leaves with an exact plan of how to get better. That's it, in a nutshell, it takes a couple hours by the end. you know, we send you a report and when we send you usually eight to 10 minutes voiced over screen video of us walking you through your running analysis.
So you have it and can review it later. Since sometimes it's a lot of info all at once, but that's my perspective. I'm sure Bertrand can tell you a bit more from a client person effective.

Kevin Chang: [00:13:17]

Yeah, coach, I mean, talk to us about your perspective when you were there and what, what are the things that you you're supposed to work on or that Kevin has given you advice to work on?
Bringing all the HIPAA

Bertrand Newson: [00:13:27]

rules right now,
first and foremost,
I want to thank, Kevin and his team for wonderful experience. , and I've had my fair share of athletic related injuries, aches, pains, and strains. I've seen my fair share of physical therapists for various elements. But by far, this is one of the most informative professional in-depth, visits that I've ever had.
And I think more importantly, that data that I got back, the exercises, the corrective, activities to help me reach my fitness goals. Fantastic. That technology, but also the in layman's terms, being able to. Break it down where it's digestible.

Kevin Chang: [00:14:10]

It's implementable.

Bertrand Newson: [00:14:12]

Very, very, user-friendly this fantastic work, Kevin.
So let's see here again, you know, I'm a running coach, you know, I, I look,
I train athletes. I look at running strive,
running forums that have
understanding of body mechanics and all those things. But it was just taken to a whole nother level from a game changing perspective, being on that treadmill and then getting that feedback
through Dr.
These eyes was fantastic. when you see yourself on video and having form explained to you, when you were, you know, you're you see yourself on the treadmill and understanding, well, you know what? I thought that I was landing on my midfoot or forefoot. But you can see what that pressure plate of the treadmill, that it was more on the, on the Hills, slight Hill striker on my left side, understanding some running injuries that have may have had recently plantar fasciitis, which I've had to navigate over the last year and a half and all the corrective measures that I've taken through other physical therapists.
through my
medical insurance and advice from other runners or self-help with frozen water bottles and racket balls or golf balls or
plantar fasciitis

sleeves, antiinflammatories two shots. And like I've always wanted to still stay active while making progress. I ran a marathon on Sunday, and I feel like I could have ran into the 10 miles.
Why? Because
I swear
because of the information I got on modifying my running form
with gardens foot strike
and some of the exercises I was able to implement post my visit with Dr. V aha moments that are going to make my running journey happier and make me that, one step closer to achieving some of those personal milestones, whether it be
Or distance based, but you understanding your own body and having video as a point of reference that is broken down.
And then the
exercise that if you do them, you will see marked improvements, measured improvements. I cannot say enough about the two hours I
with Kevin and his team. Fantastic. That profound.
I run a marathon on Sunday
and I swear it could have run another 10 miles.
I had
energy that didn't feel from a fatigue standpoint due to not running efficient. Sometimes you can kind of shoot yourself in the foot. Again, I'm six foot one on between like one, one 90 ish on a good day. so I'm a big framed runner, but being able to run smarter and having a better visual picture.
And you're running inefficiencies pointed out to you made my running economy more improved and running experience better.

Kevin Vandi: [00:16:51]

That's true for great newsman that you were able to run the marathon so well, and it's, we always tell people it's like running mantras, right. Instead of knowing thing, like, Oh, is my, here's my foot going to hurt?
Is it going to happen again? I don't know. I don't know. But being able to have a focus, like, no, no, I know what I need to correct now. Like I know, I know the mantra in the back of my, you know, for some people it's running into the wind for some people that sit in the Barstool for some people it's. You know, we use these little mantras that it's like now running becomes a skill and a practice and a focus point versus just the worry and the weight like, Oh, is it going to happen again?
We always say you, now you have power over your problem. Right. Cause you understand that knowledge is power. And when you have that, now it's just doing the work and day by day, week by week, you're going to see improvements not only in the pain, but has you've seen it in performance as well. So good on you.
Awesome. In the, was there a mantra? Or, or

Kevin Chang: [00:17:37]

some something visual that helped you during this last marathon? Was there something that you were looking at particularly or paying attention to? yes.

Bertrand Newson: [00:17:45]

Yes. As Dr V pointed out, during my evaluation, especially on the video component with the rear angle or the view on the video, looking at my foot strike.
Where I would tend to, you know, pronate and there would be a lot of, especially my left side and then seeing the pressure points. when we got a chance to look and see the foot strike on the treadmill and then looking at the wear pattern on my shoes, it all clicked for me. And then, Dr. V had
suggested a couple of
exercises to me moving my
flip from the
big toe and flexing the arch.
And trying to
sustain that level of pressure
during the run. just checking in probably like every three to five miles mentally from top to bottom feeling the inner part of my shoe, because typically I was waiting out like that and kind of hitting the side, which would, stimulate more
fatigue in a quicker fashion,
aggravating, the plantar fasciitis
causing discomfort,
which I didn't experience, the real tilts though, was the post-race soreness.
Not much, I wasn't walking like Frankenstein after the,
after the effort and any mantra.
No, usually it's for me, it's run the mile that you're in
and then just periodically.
And if that's ever three to five miles, just kind of doing a self test,
head to toe,
making sure the head is not too pronounced, leaning over.
Over, and that you have, a
strong core focusing on the
midsection. It gauging the engaged in the core with a
slight lean
I'm not running too erect or backwards. making sure that there's MI inflection and not running with a stiff knee and getting too far ahead of myself, make sure my center of mass was beneath me.
All those things. Where I wasn't trying to overthink the run again. I felt the fitness was there if you just want smart and being, having more presence of mind. But really for me, the game changer was having that pressure from on the big toe, radiating through the balance of the foot versus on
the outside or back right portion or
a left portion of the foot.
I felt the noticeable. bounce and efficiency in my
experience. So, yeah. Incredible.

Kevin Chang: [00:19:50]

Amazing. So Kevin, walk us through maybe what are some of the most common things that you see, especially for beginner runners, and then maybe we can move on towards. You know, intermediate advanced runners as well

Kevin Vandi: [00:20:03]

from a bomb mechanics standpoint, obviously there's a lot of injuries out there.
but from a pure biomechanics standpoint, we see a lot of overstride and initial runners. So basically where does your foot contact in relation to your center of mass? So an overstride is when you're basically you're reaching out, could be four foot, could be healed. Your knees straight. Your leg is like a, a dead straight position.
There's no bend in it. How we call it, we call that an overstride. And what it does is increases braking forces. It increases landing forces and it actually slows you down. And we see that a lot in new runners, especially when there's a locator, meaning maybe one 64 55, one 61 65. They're not heading that one 80 cadence and they're getting a lot of pounding pressure per step.
So for sure over strides a big one, another one, as Bertrand was mentioning his trunk lean, there's two there's pose running the teaches you to lean forward, but a lot of novice runners will actually run completely upright and some people even run backwards. When you do that, you put a lot of pressure on the anterior structures of your legs.
So quad hip flexors knees. I can develop some shin splints. That's a pretty common, you know, issue with initial runners as the upright trunk. And then finally, the other thing we see in novice runners is. What's called passive. We call passive running. there's not enough hip and not enough need, then not enough trunk lead, not enough ankle bend.
So they're running very like rigid, stiff legged. they're doing it because they might not have done the strength work. They might not have done the muscle activation work to prepare them for the demands of running. So running give or take is two to three times body weight per step. If you think about it, there's a lot of forces.
And some people, power to them. They want to start right into their running. They're motivated. Maybe they want to lose weight. Maybe they want to do it for mental health, mental clarity, whatever it may be, but they lace up their shoes and they just kind of go. But there's a, there's a problem with that, right?
When you're two X to three X body weight per step, 1500 steps, a mile, that's a lot of forces you're going to take on your body and the way the body handles it, when it doesn't have the strength. Is it then uses your joints, ankle joint, knee joint, hip joint, lower back. And so we call that passive running because you're using a non-contract out structure and then you could develop a telephone roll pain syndrome, lower back pain, you know, a patellar tendonitis.
I mean, you could develop some pretty common running injuries right out of the gate because you haven't prepared your body for strength. And you, haven't learned to absorb shock when you run. So overstride lack of trunk clean, and a passive running gait are really the three big things. I'll throw a locator in there.
It's sort of tied to trunk clean, but those are the three big things we see with novice runners.

Kevin Chang: [00:22:31]

That's incredible. Yeah. I mean, I've definitely heard about the, overstriding. I think that is. Very common. probably do it. We've seen it with our, running fundamentals crew as well. You know, and I think that kind of goes along with, as you mentioned, the cadence piece of it, if they have lower cadence, people tend to kind of overstride overextend themselves.
All of that. I haven't really heard about the passive. I forget what you call it, passive running or putting more stress on the joints.

Kevin Vandi: [00:22:56]

Is that right? Yeah, you can, you can see it when they run. So when you see a runner that's. That's had experienced. They have a long training age. They've been doing the practice we call pliable.
They have both a ability to stretch and ability to hold forces. but basically we called there's two big phases of running. The initial phase is you're floating in the air and then you're coming all the way down into your max loading, that shock absorption. And then from that piece to push off this propulsion.
So there's. Really two separate ways you have to train, you have to train your body first to absorb shock, being able to use your glute, your quad, your calf, your hamstring, a little bit, your core. That's super important in the first phase of running. And that's when most running injuries happen is in that phase.
But then you actually have to store that energy and then release it. Like in plyometric type training and you have to release it to actually push yourself forward. Well, novice runners, they don't get that initial piece. Right. They don't actually shock, absorb. They don't have enough band, like bending of the hip, bending of the knee, bending of the ankle.
Like you would see when someone would land a jump, you know, see their butt go back and they'll, they'll sit down. They run very stiff and upright. So it becomes this. Pounds, basically all the energy goes into the joint and then they have to re import that energy to be able to push off. So it's a ton of energy used upfront and a ton of energy used out back.
And that's why they get tired quicker. Their heart rate goes up and they don't have the type of running performance they need because they can't actually store that energy. so you'll see it it'll be a very stiff gait. There'll be a very loping gate. Whereas you see a runner, who's had some experience it's very springy.
They can actually absorb, push off, absorb, push off, and it's very effortless. And so when you, when you look at it in real speed, you can kind of tell the difference, but you can definitely tell the difference under the high-speed camera and with the data and angles. Sure. As part of it,

Kevin Chang: [00:24:41]

just that they need to start building the pliability and their tendons or the strength in their muscles or.
Or is it
more mental
versus like just a, Hey, they've just got to focus on form and those sorts of things, or, I mean, combination of the two or,

Kevin Vandi: [00:24:58]

yeah, it's kinda, it's kind of all of it. The biggest ones, you know, really they're our pillars. you know, our. Our running system that we call the running blueprint is really built off big pillars.
One pillar is called muscle activation. It's your brain's ability to know where a muscle is and know how to turn it on. For some people, they have that ability innately for other people. You have to practice it, but nearly everybody we worked with worked with. Can definitely improve it. The body's really good at using your quad and really good at using your calf, but it's actually really poor at using your buttock muscles.
and we found that's a big thing to work on. So, and core as well, muscle activations, big strength. Training's the next big piece again at two X body weight. if you're a 200 pound runner, that's potentially 400 pounds of force per step. Most runners aren't lifting 400 pounds in a given day. Let alone on one leg.
So we're big advocates for big, heavy strength work. So heavy deadlifts, heavy squats, heavy lunges, every step ups. You see a lot of the elite level runners these days doing it, low reps, high weight, it's a way to make yourself Bible and a way to build strength. next piece is shock absorption. Can you actually control the landing forces with running store them and release them?
Next is alignment. Is your hip, basically shoulder, hip, knee ankle on alignment, or is your knee caving in, is your pelvis dropping? Is your trunk cleaning? Those are what we call power leaks. Not only do you waste power and waste energy and efficiency, but they're also big causes of injury. and then finally plow metric, the ability to store and release energy fast and with power.
And then the mental part, the running retraining. Those are the pieces that build running skill right and competitive edge. And with the running blueprint, we believer running is a skill. Like you learn how to play the guitar, where you learn how to shoot a free throw running can be learned as well at any age for anybody, no matter the injury, you can learn to be a better runner.
There's no such thing as you can't teach an old dog new tricks. We've been runners all the way up in their eighties. And we've seen runners all the way down in the teenage years to be able to improve their form. Hell it takes it deliberate practice and the right system,

Bertrand Newson: [00:26:56]

you know, I'm doing the foot exercises as we speak right now.
Dr. V.

Kevin Vandi: [00:27:01]

Making use of the time,

Kevin Chang: [00:27:05]

some of the most common maybe injuries that you see, or some of the things that people walk into your office complaining about. And how do you, how do you help them through those types of injuries?

Kevin Vandi: [00:27:16]

Sure. Yeah. The most common runner running injuries called patellofemoral pain syndrome, or, you know, classically called runner's knee.
it's basically when there's an incongruency between the knee cap and the femur, they basically, the femur moves underneath the kneecap and it causes a higher loading forces and it causes higher pressure under the kneecap. So people will kind of complain of pain. The dances around the knee could be inside, could be outside, sometimes feels like a sharp pain limits, their running distance.
you know, approximately 25%, 30% of all runners in the world, have patellofemoral pain syndrome at any one time. so what we've done is we've created a system that really focuses on the activation strength and alignment pieces that works the absolute best for that condition. So that's definitely rehab bubble.
quickly, can do very, very well with our program running retraining, for sure, but that's probably the first most common injury, after that it band syndrome is another common injury, sort of the same idea when you have your knee and hip alignment, that's off, meaning the knee is coming inwards, but the hip is pointing straight.
What that does is it stretches the it band, create some pull at the attachment point. And then the second piece of it band syndrome is you have a crossover. So if you draw a straight line straight down the body and you reach your foot out, your foot's actually crossing that midline and that's a big cause of it band syndrome.
And so we do some running retraining grills where we basically, you can see in real time as you're running. That's the other benefit of the tech is it's not just for testing. We can put up on the screen, the actual path of the treadmill. So you can see your foot strike and we just sit there and say run, but don't let your feet cross the line.
And we can do that. We can add any piece of data to running retraining, but that works really well along with hip strengthening and pelvic alignment. And then after that, it's sort of a mixed bag. it could be plantar fasciitis. is a common injury. it could also be, lower back pain. I mean, we see a bunch of different things, but I would say I'd probably put it in the foot ankle area as the second one, plantar fasciitis, as Bertrand knows, can be a real Barrick and lasts a while sometimes upwards nine months to a year, sometimes longer.
But the, the big hallmark, sin, if you will about treating plantar fasciitis, is that they treat it like a muscle. So massage digging in water bottles. Trying to break up the adhesions, but in reality, your plantar fascia is connective tissue. it's not a muscle. And so what happens is, as weight comes down with running, or as you shock absorb, if you don't take up that load at your glute, your, but if you don't take it up at your quad, if you don't take it up at your calf, then passively, it's going to load.
Into either the foot or knee. And if you have plantar fasciitis and you don't have good food control, then the last structure is your plantar fascia. And that's where all the forces are going to go. So the actual fix is actually controlling. What's going on up above controlling the hip and pelvis controlling the knee and controlling your shock absorption.
That's been a real game changer for people who have plantar fasciitis that have tried the injections and the taping and the water and the orthotics. The piece they're missing is the chocolate corruption alignment.
###### Kevin Chang: [00:30:22]
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One question I have. Based off of that was, you talked a little bit about how people with plantar fasciitis and maybe some of these knee pains, they're not doing the proper muscle activation.
Are there certain drills? Are there certain, I mean, we talked a little bit about squats, a little bit about deadlifts,
which is a little harder these days
with the gyms, but are there drills that you would
recommend for almost any runner
regardless and. What types of drills, what types of workouts might those be?

Kevin Vandi: [00:31:08]

Yeah, I'll explain the science a little bit. So people know cause muscle activation sort of a weird, weird thing nobody really talks about, but in order for you to turn on a muscle, your brain actually has to send a signal through the motor pathways of your nervous system to basically turn the muscle on.
Now in your brain, you have, what's called a motor cortex. You have an area of the brain that controls movement. And so like your tongue and your face and your hands have big areas of brain control because it's super important for. Living eating, surviving procreation. Like you have to have that part of your brain, like super alive, but then when you get to a muscle like the glute, which is a super important running muscle, it's actually tucked in this one sulcus along with like your hamstring and your hip flexor and your TFL.
So when you go to try to access your glute, your brain, Basically doesn't know where it is because it's, it's muddled by all those other tissues. So the glue work and for your runners, like Bertrand footwork, core work, those things have to be trained through activation. And so things like probably runners on the podcast.
If they're listening, have done things like climb shells, bridges, the problem, what we see with those are, as people do them for repetitions. They push them. They push them, they push them to do 10. Good. I've done. I've done my group work. But in reality, if you go through 10 repetitions, that might be a total of 10 total seconds that your brain has to turn on a muscle.
And because you're moving, it's really easy to compensate, really easy to roll. Your hips are really easy to use your hamstring instead of your glute. So when we take a runner through activation at our lab, we use a technology called muscle EMG. It's a sensor. That goes on the glute and on a tablet you can basically see is that muscle on or off.
And there's a real time moving graph tells you. Yes. You're using that muscle or no, you're not. Some clients have called it the tattletale, right? Yes. Very revealing. There are no secrets. Yeah. How far are you actually working? Right. So in our lab, that's what we use. We can, we get to cheat. we get to make sure that you're actually getting it done.
but at home, you know, the easiest way to do it is to hold the drills, hold the clamshell, hold the sideline leg, raise, hold the bridge. And actually don't, don't look at your phone. Don't be watching TV. Don't be talking to your significant other, like you have to be, we always say you have to develop a good relationship between your mind and your, but they, they have to be dead focused on doing the work.
Because if you don't, your body's going to do what's easiest. It's going to use the least amount of energy possible to turn on that tissue. So activation is an absolute prerequisite for doing strength training. If you just jump right into heavy deadlifts or heavy squats, and you're still only using your quads, you're still not actively using your hips.
You're really not going to get the benefit out of the drill. So it has to go activation. Then it goes strength, and then it goes dynamic movement. That's the way we learn any skill. You start by putting your hands on the keyboard. And you do, I don't, I'm not a pianist, but like a D chord or whatever accord is.
And you just sit there with your hands in the same spot and you play it over and over and over again. Well, in the running world, that deliberate practice for us as muscle activation, train the brain, train the brain, train the brain when you get it right. You will know what you will feel it. And you're like, Oh, those are where my glutes are.
Now I know how to turn them on. And there'll be sore enough that when you go out and run, you're going to be like, Ooh, like I can feel that now. And you got that huge powerhouse of a muscle behind you. So use a mini band, get one of those small loop bands that goes around your knee. Hold those drills.
That's a good initial work to improve muscle activation, promote without needing a gym or other things. When you get into strength, you can put on a backpack. If you don't have weights at home, we've seen people use like big tide detergents between their legs as a deadlift. you know, you can get really creative with how you use, weights at home when you don't have access to a gym during COVID

Kevin Chang: [00:34:48]

question that we get a lot from our athletes is, you know, a lot of concern about, you know, having, I guess, wearing on their knees or, you know, Hey, is this exercise going to cause me to have knee pain as I get older and, and those types of things.
Which I know from certain studies, they say it actually helps with the knee joints and helps, but maybe it's because they're not doing a ride or stories from, so, I mean, I guess what does the science say about, running or repetitive motion or repetitive sports? And it's causing injury or causing, I guess, wear and tear on the joints over the long haul.

Kevin Vandi: [00:35:25]

What a phenomenal question. I love this question because it's the opposite of what like common thinking might suggest, right? Your doctor might tell you, Oh, you should stop running because it's going to cause knee arthritis or your friend's like, why do you, why do you run so much? You're going to tear up your knees.
You know, the reality is they've done study after study to show that runners on average have less knee arthritis than the general population. And to date, they have shown that running definitively does not cause knee arthritis. They know that for sure. In fact, runner's world, did you know a section where they just listed study after study, after study, after study showing that running does not cause knee arthritis now bad running or running within proper form can definitely accelerate.
Joint degradation and wear and tear for sure. so that's where running gets a bad name, right? It gets a bad name because I run in my knee hurts. I run, you know, people run through pain and they never address the problem. The reality is, though, if you're, if you're running with the best form, the proper shock observed in the proper alignment, you're doing all what you need to do to develop your running foundation.
There's no reason why you can't run at any decade of your life. We've seen runners that have had been diagnosed with level one, arthritis they've come to our lab and we've got them running again completely pain-free and in fact, it's made their pains, their day-to-day pains much less. So, I will tell anybody that's been told out there that's listening to this podcast.
If someone's told you not to run don't don't listen to them because like what's the trade offs your doctor says, Oh, you know, you're getting a little bit of knee pain. You should stop running. Well, the trade-off is running, has such. A wide range of implications, health wise, right? Improves your heart health and your heart strength improves.
Your cholesterol, improves your blood pressure, improves your mental mood, your sleep, your capacity at work. I'm pretty sure like on the pros and cons side, there's a lot more pro potential cost. And my personal opinion, it's like, okay. So you have a bit, our knee arthritis. Are you going to give up the sport you love or you're going to give up doing what gives you so much joy in your life for the potential that you might develop arthritis in 10 years?
I would rather say, you know what? This is what I love to do. I'm going to find the best way to do it for as long as possible. And so be it, if later on, I have a problem with my knee. Well, at least I've enjoyed a decade of running and being in a community like to legit and being. a community of runners where I feel motivated and positive and ready to go.
So yeah, don't let anybody tell you running is bad for your knees, cause it's not definitively on the record. Bam. Love it. Love it. And

Bertrand Newson: [00:37:44]

that leads to my next question.
your thoughts on that? Someone who's dealing with some running related injury, a
repetitive injury. The ability for them to stay
versus putting them on the shelf and saying, you know, you just need to rest and you need to take off.
I mean, cause it's, I've been to some physical therapist, who say, okay, take off for three weeks and I'm in the middle of a marathon training block. And maybe I'm getting the advice from another medical professional saying, you know what, if you do X, Y, and Z, you can still stay active, meaning, you know, some cardio based activities.
What is your philosophy on

Kevin Vandi: [00:38:18]

that? Yeah. Great question. We get that question all the time. You know, unfortunately, some PTs chiros docs get a bad rap because they tell runners to stop running. And, you know, after doing this more than a decade, I can definitively tell you, even if I tell a runner to stop, they're not, I'm gonna do it.
My bad. Our goal is basically, if this is your threshold of whatever tissues involved, it all comes down to the tissue. If it's bone. Like, if you're, if you're on the verge of developing a stress fracture, then, then you actually have to stop. Like, that's not a, that's not an option. Right. But if it's a tendonitis, it's attendant, if it's a muscle, you know, if it's connective tissue, then you, then you can play around a little bit.
But our philosophy of this is your threshold. If this is the threshold that causes pain, we want you to live right here. We don't want you to live down here arbitrarily. It's like, what is, what is that limit? Right. And everybody has one where on one side you might be able to run a eight minute pace and be okay, but you run seven 50 and it puts you over the limit, right?
You might be able to run five miles, but if you run 5.25, now you run into a problem. So to find out, well, what is that breaking limit? Where what's your max capacity you can do without making your problem worse. And that's where you're going to live, but all of our programs that competitive edge, and you know, this should be a philosophy for everybody is keep someone as active as possible.
Keep them running for as long as possible during the program, you know, and, and worst case scenario, you try it, it doesn't work out. You, you bring the level down, you try it, it doesn't work out. You bring it down. You will, you will eventually find a point where someone can do something. Even if it's still like.
Cycling yoga. I mean, people, people can do something to be active, but ideally we want to keep runners running for as long as possible without shutting down the system. Another follow-up

Bertrand Newson: [00:40:01]

your thoughts on utilizing and incorporating cold therapy versus heat therapy in the form of the recovery process when, when best to do so.

Kevin Vandi: [00:40:10]

Yeah. Also a common question. You know, I sing, you know, almost always is better. Yeah, definitely not beforehand, you know, icing actually constricts blood flow, it makes tendon stiffer. so it's definitely not. That's the principle of a warmup, right? You actually need to get hot. You have to sweat, you have to get warm.
So if you're going to use, if you're going to use ice, it's always afterwards as a mean of means of recovery, you know, using ice packs and those things for handling swelling and other things, it's sort of fallen out of favor in the science. you know, I will let you know, like ice baths, if you're, if you've done, like I'm training for a marathon and you're training for an iron man, and you just put out six hours of work.
I mean, even though the science might not say it, it still feels good, at least afterwards, nice battle, and you know, and get some recovery. I can't, I can't speak that there's actual any hard science, you know, placebo, is it placebo or is it an actual thing? If you have active swelling, if you actually have a swollen joint that is effective, as long as you ice for at least 20 minutes, with an ice pack or shorter, if it's direct, if it's like a pinpoint area, like an elbow, or like right on your knee cap, then you can go an ice cup for five minutes.
It really depends on, is there a barrier between the ice and your body? but in terms of, heat, you know, muscle strains do really well with heat cause you get blood flow to the area. Again, I think it's more of a feel good thing. I think active recovery is probably the best of both worlds, active warmup, active recovery.
active warmup is going to get your body going, gonna get your muscles active, going to get your brain involved, going to get your temperature up, much more so than like an isolated, like one area of your body. And then in terms of a cool down in terms of controlling muscle stiffness soreness, delayed onset muscle soreness.
Brilliant active recovery is best. It might be hopping on the bike for eight minutes. It might be doing some dynamic stretching. It might be doing some light yoga, just something to kind of eradicate. I don't even want to call it lack to gas because we know it's a mix of things, but that lactic acid feel is just active movement is definitely better than ice alone.

Kevin Chang: [00:42:06]

When you talk about active warmup, what, what types of activities does that mean? Does that just mean going slower
on your jog before you, before you started hitting it?
Or is it

Kevin Vandi: [00:42:16]

something that great, great question. we've written a lot about this because warmup really does matter, you know, but really it's both mental and physical.
how you, speak to the mental side first. Like every run should have a purpose. If it's a recovery run is for recovery. If it's for speed, it's for speed. If it's for distance, it's for distance, a lot of runners get in the mindset of they're just like they just go out and run and there's no focus, but in reality, when runners are supposed to run slow, they don't.
And when they're supposed to run fast, they don't. so it's a real, it's a really weird thing. It's like recovery runs need to be like stupidly slow and speed workouts need to be stupidly fast to get, you know, to get results. but you have to like first speed workout. Like you got to amp yourself up.
Like, it's like, you're going to do a Mac, like deadlift, you gotta be ready to go. So there needs to be some mental training. It might be an affirmation statement. It might be a, okay, what's the purpose of my run? What do I want to get out of it? I think that's really important from a warmup standpoint, physiologically from a body standpoint, we really prefer many band work band around the knees.
doing some lateral walks, doing some monster walks, doing some quick squats. we have a funny drill. We call a pizza cutter. That's basically like a quick, like back lunge into the band. but I really liked drills that are dynamic involve movement, involve muscle activation, and then get you sweaty, you know, five, eight minutes.
We said like, once you start to feel that beat a sweat, come down your head or you start to feel yourself, get warm. You're good to go.

Kevin Chang: [00:43:34]

What about active recovery? So you said active recovery will help with the, the dorms and all of that. Is that done right after the workout? You're you're going from a run right into like a biking movement or something.
Is, is that kind of the recommendation or is it

Kevin Vandi: [00:43:48]

yeah, for sure. It's crashing is always the big thing. People talk about stretching before and activity has never been proven to actually reduce injury risks, like literally never in any study. So stretching beforehand is not going to keep you, is not going to lower your injury risk.
However, stretching afterward can definitely make it. You recover faster, can make it so you don't nearly get a stiff and you know, that cool-down process of. Stretching is actually because you have blood flow to your muscles. Now they have capacity to actually elongate to actually retain the movement benefit of stretching.
Whereas if you do cold stretching, it may feel good, but it's not actually changing the length of the tissue. So you have to do it after workout. And again, maybe five, 10 minutes throw some core work in. do some, it might be like, inchworms like, putting your problems on the ground, walking out and moving your heel, you know, your, your feet up to your hands.
you know, it might be some like lumbar twists. I mean, honestly it could be anything, you know, we have, some pliability drills. We take runners through, that we found to be successful, but honestly, it's just. Stretch the big ones, stretch your hamstrings, stretch your calf, make sure you do a little core work.
And then, you know, the five, eight minutes, make sure you're actually cooled down. Look at your, look at your heart rate. If your heart rate still a one 50, like you're not, you're not cooled down under a hundred, probably for most people. Yeah.

Kevin Chang: [00:45:09]

So dynamic, stretching over static stretching, and that is that kind of the preference.
Awesome. And then. Well, what about foam rollers and percussion guns and those types of things,

Kevin Vandi: [00:45:21]

do you from rollers, we call, we call that stuff like mashing, basically. So it does two things. One it hurts, which means you're going to trigger that like fight or flight response, you're going to start to sweat.
so there is like, Like systemic benefit to it. But foam rolling is really good for like pinpoint spots. Like definitely your quad, your, you know, your it band, although, you know, whether that's actually truly effective as debatable your adductor, but then things like your calf or your foot really needs to be like a lacrosse ball.
or even like an Olympic barbell. It has to be much harder cause it's, you know, it's hard to actually push into the foam roll. and then percussion guns are really good, like for muscle recovery. So that could be like, Dynamic cool-down and then muscle gun, like if you happen to get sore quads, when you run, are you having to get to our ad doctors in our thigh muscles?
That's where the guns going to be? Definitely be effective. Yeah, but I would just say, if you have soreness somewhere after running it's consistent, then you should probably have taken a look at. The reason why it's getting store. It's not just treating the symptoms.

Bertrand Newson: [00:46:24]

Dr. V. Other question for you regarding exercise types.
if you were to suggest between these three exercises for rider on granted, they all have their own unique benefit. but from your perspective, whether it be
push-ups planks
or burpees, which one from a runner's perspective is most effective. If there had once one or two to do, what would you say?

Kevin Vandi: [00:46:46]

that's a tough call. That's a tough call. It's, they're each interesting because like w two or like chest driven exercises, one's core. I mean, I would say probably planks out of all the three, I think burpees, you can screw up a lot to the point where you end up with more problems than helping. and you get enough really hit training anyway, when you run.
Yeah. I've seen people really mess up or piece, you know, they let their back sag and you jam their arms. pushups are, they do involve some abs, but not really. And you know, you don't need to have strong pecs to be a good runner. So I don't think that's like a super effective drill it's for show basically.
And then I would say, I would say definitely clients, you know, you see people, if you look from a side view and you look at someone's pelvis, a lot of people let their, if this is the front of their body, let their pelvis tilt down called the anterior pelvic tilt. And that can cause hamstring problems can cause me problems, but really the abs that set up here, pull the pelvis.
Back up to neutral. and they actually help with controlling the pelvis from a pelvic drop standpoint, at least to some degree. So I would say planks are probably the most effective out of those, although it's, it's like, what's your goal? Like if you're going to lose weight, the burpees might be better.
You know, if you just want to look good with your shirt off, the pushups may be better at all. Depends.

Kevin Chang: [00:47:57]

My understanding is your lab works with not just runners, but athletes of all types.
Right? So, I know for me, a lot of CrossFit when the gyms are open and, not, not now. And I'm looking to really, improve my power lifting as well. I am close to holding the gym record. I think my dead lifts up to . 507. , and I know I have some imbalances, like in my hips too, I know my form's not, perfect.
other than runners, what
other types of analyses can you do when somebody walks into your lab? what other types of things are you looking at how can you help those types of athletes?

Kevin Vandi: [00:48:34]

Yeah, it's a great question. So, the best part about data technologies, you can apply to anybody.
We treat a lot of dancers. We treat a lot of powerlifters, but with power lifting, the big thing always comes down to form timing and really comes down to muscle balance like you're talking about. So we can take the EMG that we have, those, those wireless muscle sensors, like a deadlift, let's say we can throw it on your glutes, both glutes, and we can throw it on both hamstrings.
And we can say, okay, let's get a ratio. How much are you using your right side in comparison to your left side? What's the, what's the maximum activation on your right or the average, which the average on your left and then the report will spit out. Well, you're actually using your right side 30% more than your left side during a deadlift.
So then we know we can focus your training in, on getting that left side stronger. we do it with high-speed video. Yeah, for power lifting as well. So we break it down on the 300 frames per second camera and we begin to say, okay, w at what point do you get to the pole? What point do you get the catch?
You know, are you actually getting triple extension, you know, during a clean and jerk, let's say, so we can break down any movement via video in EMG, for sure. for a powerlifter. and then for regular athletes that do team sports, like soccer, basketball, we do what's called an injury risk test or return to sport tests.
Where we throw on all the sensors that we have, you do a step down box, jump deceleration, lateral shuffle, 90 degree, cut and triple hot. And we basically, and there's a force plate in the ground. There's linear plate that reads how hard you're hitting, what your alignment is left side compared to right side.
And we basically do performance testing to figure out are you at risk of injury? We'll give you an injury risk score. And then we also tell you how you can improve performance. That's exactly what we do with the San Jose earthquakes. So we're the team provider for the quakes. We do their whole team, injury risk testing at the beginning of the year.
And we provide the team, basically a scoring sheet saying, Hey, your players need to work on this category of strength. They need to work on this category of alignment. and we do that with teams as well.

Kevin Chang: [00:50:26]

I know I'm going to have to drag my wife in my wife is a tap dancer, ballet dancer
has she definitely deals with all sorts of,
Injuries things over the years. um, so I mean, I think, yeah, this is so fantastic that we can bring technology into this, that we can
what the joints are doing, through the different movements.
Can it kind of get a better sense of, of what's going on and, and analyze it to a, to a better degree. This is.

Kevin Vandi: [00:50:52]

Crazy. This is incredible. The answer when you put sensors on and they go through an Aira bask, or they go through a Relevate, you can actually get all those angles no matter where they are in the lab.
And so it's really cool because it's not like pinpointed to just, Oh, you have to be at 90 degrees and you gotta be in front of the camera. You could, you could be anywhere doing any motion. and surprise, you know, we have a relationship with a couple ballet studios. You know, it's not, I'm not a ballet dancer.
I found that there there's a need inside the dance world of precision motion. And that's where our data, because it's accurate to a degree of movement. We can get that precision to either improve, you know, how something looks, the aesthetics of dance. Or the, you know, injury, risk, performance side of dance.

Kevin Chang: [00:51:38]

Talk to us a little bit about, you know, now that the pandemic has hit, some people might not have access to your physical location and you guys are doing something a little bit different virtually or having some different virtual offerings. So give us a
sense of, of what those offerings are. How
can people participate?
How can they. get their form analyzed by your crew.

Kevin Vandi: [00:51:57]

Sure. Yeah, it's super cool. You know, although you don't want pandemics to happen, there's always you know, a silver lining in it. And for us, we've been able to consult with a, this artificial intelligence company where you can, you can be anywhere in the world.
We work from people in the UK, South Africa, all over the United States. But you can take your iPhone. You can shoot a slow-mo video. You upload it to our Dropbox account. The artificial intelligence software will analyze your running gait and it'll spit out automatically your initial contact, deep knee flection in terminal stance of running with specific angles for trunk clean, hip flection, knee flection, ankle control.
It'll give you a back view as well. And so we've been able to do pinpointed detailed running analysis from anywhere, which has been awesome, because if you're fearful of COVID, you don't want to get out of your house or you live far away. we can still help you. We can still take our running blueprint program that we use in the lab and we can bring it into the online world.
That's been, it's been wonderful. Our team will sit down for, we have an amazing team, incredible, doctors of PT, incredible front desk staff. I mean, we will walk you through the whole process. but what the, what we'll do is we'll sit down with you for an hour. We'll walk you through the videos. Then we're, we've come up with a functional testing system.
So specific drills to do at home to get the same data we would get in the lab in terms of your movement scale. And by the end of that one hour, like we did for Bertrand, you will have an exact plan and focus of how to take, take you to where you want to go and running. So that's our virtual gait analysis.
It's been super cool. Clients have loved it. And again, you know, not something I had originally planned for the, for 2020, but, there's definitely ways we've been able to help people so they can do it from home. That's incredible. Yeah. And then the other thing is, you know, we've runners for the last five years have been asking me, Kevin, you need to take your whole running program and you need to put it online.
You need to make it so we can access your videos and your training from anywhere you need to put it into a calendar. So we have daily exercises we can follow. You have to, you know, we'd love if you did coaching calls with us. So what we did is we took our whole running program and we made an online running blueprint program and that's literally an entire year of planned exercise.
So day by day, you're going to get. The glute work you need to do with the core work you need to do the stretching you need to do. I know runners hate going to the gym. They don't like lifting. You have to do look at this and say, there's my workout and we've built it. So we have three terabytes of running data that we've collected over the last five years.
And we've taken all that data and we've distilled it down into how does a runner actually learn the skill of running? How is this done? Cause there was a, there is a right way and a wrong way. And so the online running blueprint is our. Like hope program wrapped into one. So you get the 12 months of planned exercises.
You get a virtual running analysis when you were the program. And then I jump on a coaching call live every two weeks. So twice a month, you can ask me questions about forum. We can go through exercises. You can ask me questions about injuries. So I'm there to walk you through the process as your coach and guide.
and then finally, you're going to get our playability blueprint, which is our stretching program that you can use the 14 best stretchers for runners. So that's been a huge success around the world. People have loved it. you know, we knew we had something good in the lab and we knew we were having success over 90% of our runners have hit not only their pain and injury goals, but if it new PRS.
And so finally we listened to the pit, the people of the lab, and they're like, just put it online. So, you know, I recorded some videos did way too many takes on most of them
you can help us out. yeah, but that's called the online running blueprint and, you know, for show notes, I can give you links to all this stuff as well.

Kevin Chang: [00:55:27]

That's fantastic. What is the price or what was the cost?

Kevin Vandi: [00:55:30]

The cost for the whole year program is nine 97. Wow.

Kevin Chang: [00:55:34]


Kevin Vandi: [00:55:34]

fantastic. Yeah. And if people hop in now where, you know, you can get to virtual running Gates, which are typically three 50 each, you can get those both included in the program has that we're running as a holiday sale.
So if you're, if you're interested in you're tickled and you want to get the most out of your running season in 2021, definitely check it out. And speaking of the blueprint

Bertrand Newson: [00:55:53]

to talk about, you know, your masterpiece here.

Kevin Vandi: [00:55:56]

Yeah. So not only do, did people ask me, Hey Kev, can you put it, you know, your program into an online format, but some people don't, some people don't like online, some people want it in print.
So a couple of years ago I started writing down our program and I had the idea of running a book. I wanted to get it out to the world. I want people to see that there's a better way to look at running a whole new paradigm of seeing running as a skill versus just. Something you're born with. I want people to have hope.
I want people to have a process to follow to weed through all the mess that's on Google and the confusion about running and put it into a easy to read digestible God, a little nerdy, a little data focused, but you know, I wanted it to have the concrete metrics of what running is. So it's called the running blueprint.
You know, it's a science-backed training system, unlock your speed, improve performance. and it runs you through our program, runs you through some exercises. Gives you a foundation of how to look at your running mantras, great stories from runners I've treated, that have done well and hit new PRS, and that's available on Amazon and our competitive edge website.
so just again, our passionate competitive edge, we, 80% of runners get injured every year. And that's a travesty. We know how important running is to people's lives. And so we're doing our part. We want wanna, we want to reach the world. We want to drop that number down. running has been a big impact in my life and the, the clients we've treated.
And so we wanted to give back and created a program where, runners can truly improve and do what they love for the rest of their lives. Incredible.

Kevin Chang: [00:57:22]

Just want to say, thank you so much for joining us on this podcast. I learned so much over the last hour. I'm sure I
will be
constantly emailing and figuring things out and we'll, we'll, we'll be figuring out.
A lot of things out with you, and I'm sure that there's
a ton of partnership and other opportunities going forward.
Great to be chatting
with a local company. Great to be chatting with you. And can't wait to continue this conversation as we move forward. So again, want to say, thank you so much for jumping on

Kevin Vandi: [00:57:50]

my pleasure.
This has been a lot of fun. I love to teach and educate and you know, you guys are awesome and you know, it's just fun talking and running and having a good time with people. And, yeah, just, just thanks for the opportunity. It's been awesome. Thanks doctor. Appreciate it.
###### Kevin Chang: [00:58:03]
Well, I hope you enjoyed this episode of the race mob podcast. Check out all of the show notes or find a running buddy [email protected]. Please subscribe to us on Apple, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to your podcasts and leave us a review until next time. Keep on moving.